[feank]

Hi, Today I got a new NDH30, I sold my first one month ago and this new one I felt that miss the deep soundstage that my other had....not sure if it's a real fact or only a perception but I'm concerned about this issue, one of the main reasons cause i bought again was this characteristic, there different tunning??, or maybe there are fake ones around, anyway i bought from Ebay same seller than last time

 

[Nkam]

Hi, Today I got a new NDH30, I sold my first one month ago and this new one I felt that miss the deep soundstage that my other had....not sure if it's a real fact or only a perception but I'm concerned about this issue, one of the main reasons cause i bought again was this characteristic, there different tunning??, or maybe there are fake ones around, anyway i bought from Ebay same seller than last time

Our hearing memory is pretty bad.
That said, our hearing is also influenced a ton by circumstances. Since it’s not only our ears which hear but moreso our ear/brain.
I’ve had that happen before.
Heard a new piece of gear in a certain mood and was surprised. Then listened again and didn’t have the same effect.
I’m pretty even keeled so it doesn’t happen often. But it happens for sure.

 

[feank]

Could be a possibility …… I was checking Neumann web site and they has this warning

 

[chesebert]

P65 is total BS IMO.

 

[chesebert]

Hi, Today I got a new NDH30, I sold my first one month ago and this new one I felt that miss the deep soundstage that my other had....not sure if it's a real fact or only a perception but I'm concerned about this issue, one of the main reasons cause i bought again was this characteristic, there different tunning??, or maybe there are fake ones around, anyway i bought from Ebay same seller than last time

Typical unit to unit variation. Shouldn’t have sold if you liked your last pair.

 

[Nkam]

Could be a possibility …… I was checking Neumann web site and they has this warning

And?

 

[Mike F]

Normal sample variation as @chesebert says. I’ve listened to 4 – all different. All headphones have that in common. Some people are more perceptive of sample variations than others, and contrary to popular belief here, I think that our aural memory is better than most people think. If it wasn’t capable of discerning very subtle variations without reference over a long period of time there would be no point in having anything but the cheapest capable headphones on the market.

 

[activestatic]

Which companies sell the 2.5mm locking balanced connectors for the NDH series headphones. So far all the ones I see are cheap plastic body connectors. Hart Audio, Lavricables and Fog City Audio all use plastic bodied connectors for their custom cable builds. Moon Audio has one with a metal screw on body but the neck/shank is too short to fit in the headphone socket. I guess if I’m going to spend $300 or more on a custom cable I’d want a more premium look and feel. Has anyone had any success finding the unicorn I desire?

 

[Nkam]

It sucks that the connectors to the headphones aren’t the industry standard ones so we can make our own cables.

It’s not even the Senheiser Jack.

Why oh why couldn’t they just make it a 3 or 4 pin mini XLR??


Ugh

 

[headstef]

Which companies sell the 2.5mm locking balanced connectors for the NDH series headphones. So far all the ones I see are cheap plastic body connectors. Hart Audio, Lavricables and Fog City Audio all use plastic bodied connectors for their custom cable builds. Moon Audio has one with a metal screw on body but the neck/shank is too short to fit in the headphone socket. I guess if I’m going to spend $300 or more on a custom cable I’d want a more premium look and feel. Has anyone had any success finding the unicorn I desire?

According to physics (electromagnetics) no cable can ever compromise audibly an audio signal, if it is properly made - good connections (and good shield where necessary). This means a few dollars cost for DIY solutions. Cables start to affect very slightly a signal at much-much higher frequencies, totally unrelated to the audio spectrum of human hearing. Needless to say that all blind tests show exactly the same, invariably. Expensive "upgrade" cables are pure marketing (in a bad sense). Of course, many will disagree but I think it is good to write here, from time to time, what science indicates.
Using balanced cables for headphones is a more complicated matter: the balanced output of a head-amp may give a better or different sound than its single-ended output. Again, this is not an effect of cables used but the effect of different circuitry. All other things being equal, a single-ended amp will give higher quality sound than a balanced amp OF THE SAME COST, simply because the construction and materials cost goes to two channels (SE) instead of four (Balanced).

All the above means that in an environment with no electromagnetic noise issues (that may require the use of balanced appliances), one has no reason to throw money on balanced appliances or cables. The "highest end" sound can be achieved with SE solutions and, of course, with decent low cost cables. The only effective upgrade is always better electronics (mainly dacs) for your beloved headphones.

Having said these, I must add that I too was unable to find a fitting mini TRRS plug (2.5 mm, 4 contacts) able to be inserted in the NDH-30. All commercially available plugs have wider handle that will not fit in the deep socket of the Neumann. I ended up using a Sennheiser replacement cable for HD-560S to thin its plug handle with a cutter, the locking part too. My end purpose was to re-terminate its other end with a Pentacon balanced plug to test the balanced output of a dongle-dac (extensive descriptions in older posts). An other solution is to re-terminate a Neumann replacement cable at the amp end, if you have to use a balanced amp. Ready made solutions from other companies are nice too, as long as you don't pay silly money expecting sonic upgrades due to "special" materials or obscure theories.

 

[activestatic]

Here is a pic of the adapter from Moon Audio. The shaft is too short. I am out roughly $22 total including shipping. Not a big deal. I think it would be perfect due to metal screw on body. The connector is only $10. The remaining pictures are of my amp, EQ and DAC.

 

[Angel III]

According to physics (electromagnetics) no cable can ever compromise audibly an audio signal, if it is properly made - good connections (and good shield where necessary). This means a few dollars cost for DIY solutions. Cables start to affect very slightly a signal at much-much higher frequencies, totally unrelated to the audio spectrum of human hearing. Needless to say that all blind tests show exactly the same, invariably. Expensive "upgrade" cables are pure marketing (in a bad sense). Of course, many will disagree but I think it is good to write here, from time to time, what science indicates.
Using balanced cables for headphones is a more complicated matter: the balanced output of a head-amp may give a better or different sound than its single-ended output. Again, this is not an effect of cables used but the effect of different circuitry. All other things being equal, a single-ended amp will give higher quality sound than a balanced amp OF THE SAME COST, simply because the construction and materials cost goes to two channels (SE) instead of four (Balanced).

All the above means that in an environment with no electromagnetic noise issues (that may require the use of balanced appliances), one has no reason to throw money on balanced appliances or cables. The "highest end" sound can be achieved with SE solutions and, of course, with decent low cost cables. The only effective upgrade is always better electronics (mainly dacs) for your beloved headphones.

Having said these, I must add that I too was unable to find a fitting mini TRRS plug (2.5 mm, 4 contacts) able to be inserted in the NDH-30. All commercially available plugs have wider handle that will not fit in the deep socket of the Neumann. I ended up using a Sennheiser replacement cable for HD-560S to thin its plug handle with a cutter, the locking part too. My end purpose was to re-terminate its other end with a Pentacon balanced plug to test the balanced output of a dongle-dac (extensive descriptions in older posts). An other solution is to re-terminate a Neumann replacement cable at the amp end, if you have to use a balanced amp. Ready made solutions from other companies are nice too, as long as you don't pay silly money expecting sonic upgrades due to "special" materials or obscure theories.

I completely agree with everything you wrote. I would also add the silver and gold fuses in the darkness of the self-convincing of the miraculous sound. In my Lehmann that I bought used, I found one of these wonders inside. I did all kinds of tests with my 16 ohm closed-back headphones and premium fuse, but it didn't bring any kind of improvement (and this amp absolutely doesn't need it). Lehmann, which has been making amplifiers for years, uses standard fuses and I inserted these (approved for maximum safety). Be careful because some fuses with the same amperage, even if delayed, can be less sensitive to blowing (This is why I prefer standard approved fuses).

 

[Miki_asd]

I get what you are saying and I agree that most young people prefer personal audio over a stereo (they will rather buy a Bluetooth speaker) but I think that the age drastically increases after the 400/500 or even the 250 dollar mark in both headphones and IEMs.

I'm a 27 year old headphone enthusiast. I started this hobby around 10 years ago. Before I had any income my ideal range were around $200 MSRP for a headphone and similar price range for a DAC + AMP combo. When I heard the Quad Era-1 I fell in love, but it was just a dream to buy that one day.
After I had income I could afford to buy stuff more easily. And I was pretty lucky too. I got the quad for $250-300, got a Teac UD-301 for 200 and a Teac HA-501 for 250-300. Buying a HP for $800 wouldn't be unimaginable for me, but I'm probably just a somewhat rare hp nerd or idk.

Speaker hifi seams like a prestigious hobby to me, while headfi is much more approachable. And yes, not needing to have a room dedicated for the hobby or worrying about bothering other with it is a big upside. A lot of people can't even afford to have open headphones, because they can be too loud.
That being said, most people just don't care about quality and buy pop or cheap products. A TWS for outside of home/work, maybe a closed relatively cheap headphone for work and a relatively cheap open or closed headphone or some cheap speakers. At least this is what I see.

I also want to say that I got into the wired earbud stuff at some point, you can get great quality for $20 (Yincrow X6) and for general PC usage it's perfectly enough, while it's more comfortable than a headphone and produces so little sound it won't bother anyone around you and you can still hear your surroundings. I can't enjoy it's sound anymore, because I bought a DIY earbud for $140 and it's amazing, it may sound better than any headphone under $250 msrp (It's once upon audio's phoenix. I'm hungarian and it's made by another hungarian guy, so i had the opportunity to try it and I was convinced.).
Having a speaker system? I would never...

I heard a lot of headphones under msrp $650 and I only 3 gave me an amazing experience while listening. Quad Era-1, Grado Hemp and Neumann NDH-30. I haven't heard the anandas or higher tier hifimans, only the Edition xs from the over $250 range, tho I love the egg shaped hifiman cup (and the grado's on ear nature makes it uncomfortable for me).
Also the more dacs and amp I try the more I gravitate towards Teac's stuff. I kinda want an UD-503 as well. "Better quality" is useless if the experience is worse. Acquiring the XP and gaining the skill to hear what sounds best for you is when the real endgame starts. I have my endgame system with the quad and the 2 teacs. I'll buy an NDH-30 as a secondary hp and an ifi iUSB is on it's way to let me forget about the pre-dac part of the system.

One more thing...

I am pretty sure many people here on this forum that spend amazing amounts of money on this hobby can only do so, because they already earned a lot of money in their life and are actually in their mid- to late 40s or even older.

This forum and it's UI is outdated. I don't think young folks would use it regularly, I'm not using it either. For me this is mostly an archive for some useful information.

Tbh even forums are kinda outdated... Other hp forums aren't popular or are dead. Even most hp discord servers aren't popular enough or are just dead as well. While in practice, hp youtubers or bloggers doesn't really help, nor forums tbf.
Local community hp forums are the best, because you can offer to each other to listen to each others's stuff. I heard most stuff by going to people's home or inviting them to mine.

Tho it's pretty easy in Hungary, because this is a small country with one big capital and a lot of hp enthusiasts live in the capital. We have a Hungarian tech forum with a hp topic that allow us to connect. So we have a good platform that makes it possible to gain experience without going to rare and big shows. Most people around the world probably don't have this "luxory". Youtube, reddit, headfi or other global platforms doesn't even compare in usefulness. Global platforms are only good to bring in new ideas and inspire some to buy products that are less known here, but are approved by the global communities.

BUT! Have you guys heard about the quad era-1? No big youtubers talk about it, while I love it, it's one of my favs. And I heard it on an event I organized 5 years ago, and a dude brought it who at the time mostly lived in England. I fell in love with it's sound then. And it was the same pair I happened to buy a year ago. It's wild. If it wasn't for that topic in our local forum, I wouldn't even have heard about it...

 

[Plieb]

This is a must listen on the ndh30. Using with singxer amp. Hi-Res recording. This is why the ndh 30 is a different animal.
Just wow!

 

[deafLovesMusic]

Agreed, this is excellent piece of music and a great recording (incredible soundstage and instrument separation), many thanks for sharing!
It sounds amazing with the NDH 30 and the Chord Mojo 2.

This is a must listen on the ndh30. Using with singxer amp. Hi-Res recording. This is why the ndh 30 is a different animal.
Just wow!