[ClieOS]

  As explained earlier, this isn't someone taking a photograph and editing for hours, or an artist drawing for twenty hours on a piece of paper, or a chef making a bloody brilliant dish that you make for a contest. It's a manufacturer begging for your education, for your massive infusion of funds, for something no one every has asked in the industry for a completely lop-sided prize. Usually, the company puts up a contest, asks for great tries, and then give out prizes commensurate with the effort.
 
Here, we have a company that wants you to give away your technology. It's not a fecking souffle; it's hundreds if not thousands of hours that Hifman want from some dupe. They get free R&D. That does NOT happen anywhere. This is ridiculous.

 
This is in the first post: "...and there is a chance to have business cooperation."
 
I'll assume that means they are not going to just take your design and run away. They certainly seems very interested in taking the winning design into production - and the by 'cooperation', I'll assume it will be some kind of partnership where the designer either get an one-time payment or some sort of profit sharing.
 
There are actually a few individuals in China already make their own amp card and sold them online, ranging for $100~150 or so. Some are getting rave review from users as well. But almost all of them are limited run, from just a handful of boards to a few dozens or so, as they are mostly enthusiasts who have a day job and can't afford mass production (many kind of organized like a Kickstarter project over a few forums). The way I see it, this contest is probably aiming to draw those people out of the woods and turns those pet projects into official product. I doubt some senior engineer of some space agency will seriously want to win a pair of headphone so bad they are going to spend the time, money and effort to design an amp card.

 

[shigzeo]

That is the UPDATED first post. It did not originally say that, and even so, it says 'chance to have'. Their designers still get too look at (and do whatever they want) with your handiwork, there are no guarantees, no stipulations, no nothing in this contest to protect you from anything. Also brought up: what about your player? What if it fries? Do you have to make/tool the board yourself? Do they supply it? How 'bout the player? Not only is this too open-ended, it is greedy. 
 
There is no way to spin this. It isn't an open contest pitting wits vs wits that the industry can judge. It's a closed system with so many murky sides to it. We all love HiFiman products. I'm sure all of us own or have owned something from them. I'm a big fan of their 601 and a number of their headphones, but this contest isn't merely poorly worded, it sounds like a go to jail free card.

 

[ClieOS]

So it would have been much better to say "designer retains the right of the design"? I am not against that. As I have said, they need more fine print to make that sort of things clear to everyone. Some outside judges are not a bad idea either,
 
As for frying your own HM901, I think (or at least I hope) any one who is capable of designing / making the amp card is knowledgable enough to avoid that kind of mistake (plus, the is simulator built into circuit software). Anyway, I am pretty sure you need to contract a PCB maker (and some do work with small batch) to make the PCB. All you do is design it, send the design off to a PCB maker for the board manufacturing, solder the components on after you have all your parts, test it with some equipments before plugging your headphone in (the last few processes really ain't that different from making a cmoy). Well, at least that's what those those Chineses DIYers have done with their homebrew amp card.

 

[Rush87]

  Anyway, I am pretty sure you need to contract a PCB maker (and some do work with small batch) to make the PCB. All you do is design it, send the design off to a PCB maker for the board manufacturing, solder the components on after you have all your parts, test it with some equipments before plugging your headphone in (the last few processes really ain't that different from making a cmoy). Well, at least that's what those those Chineses DIYers have done with their homebrew amp card.

 
Do you have any idea how much all of this costs and how much time it takes to do all of this?
Just to have a small batch of PCBs manufactured and assembled by a contractor would be way more expensive than the price of the headphones, even if manufactured in China.
The only way to have low cost electronics is to mass produce, prototyping is super expensive.
The contest might interest some low wage workers, like those Chinese DIYers, but I believe that Head-Fi is a mostly western high wage audience.

 

[ClieOS]

...

 
Which is why I said the contest is probably aiming at those DIYer in China, who already spent the money and done making their amp card even before there is contest.

 

[roamling]

I am glad I won a ifi micro iDSD already. Good luck to the contestants in this one.

 

[Armaegis]

Third idea: pick some opamps with high current delivery (ad8397?) so you can skip the buffers and save space, use the remaining board real estate for the appropriate circuitry and regulators and replace the battery cover with a solar panel.
 
Fourth idea: hamster wheel. Everyone loves hamsters. And they're cheaper than the opa627's you've been using.

 

[GrindingThud]

Would be interesting to do a collaborative effort with schiit.

 

[Makiah S]

Actually in all honesty... I think Audio GD and Hifiman would be a great pairing! 
 
Also this thread isn't even on the Front Page any more, let's hope Hifiman rethinks this contest 

 

[AnakChan]

All, this thread is about a contest Hifiman is holding. Please keep this about questions of the particulars & the eligibility of the contest, it's not for you to question it's validity or it's agenda nor alternatives.

Please stay on topic.

 

[KT66]

I'd like to see Graham Slee make a 901 card, or how about Audio Note??

 

[Makiah S]

  So... is there a base design file with pinout/contact information from the mainboard or is this just a "show us what you've made" sorta deal?

 
 

  you mean from scratch?

 
 

 
Doesn't help in this discussion as I don't see a thread on how to construct a Hifiman amp card.
 
Are they expecting us to use their card format for the amp?
 

 
 

Originally Posted by audio technica /img/forum/go_quote.gif
  I've got some questions about this before participating...
 
1. What qualifies as an entry?
2. What DOESN'T qualify as an entry?
3. What do we need to participate?
4. What are the design requirements?

Very good questions still no answer 
 

 
+1 - as a potential designer here I'd want to know what supply rails are available at what currents. Also maximum thickness (i.e. height above PCB) as I reckon the best sounding amp will have trafos in it.....

 
 

Originally Posted by MrTom /img/forum/go_quote.gif  
I see on the website that the amplifier expects +/- 8.2 V
 
- What's the maximum current the amplifier board can draw?
- Is there a maximum current draw that Hifiman wants to stay under?
- Is there any noise we can expect on the power supply rails? (there must be a boost converter or similar in there?)
 
 
For the physical layout:
 
- A technical drawing of a blank board would be great
- Functions of the contact pads?
- How much clearance do we get on each side on the board?
- Thickness of the PCB?
 
 
Thanks,
 
Tom

Again also no answers to these, 
 

   
They didn't specify but i think that would be mostly the work on their end. I would assume they would want a topology more than anything else they they would then use in their designs if they liked it. If they really expect everything you outlined above, that is really dumb for a $900 prize.

Actually Kudos @MrTom his questions are the best thus far
 
but as Mab1376, said "I would assume" there needs too be very little left to assume with something like this 
 
and Hifimans second update still leaves a lot to "assume" there needs to be as little assumptions as possible for the safety of both parities 

 

[kchapdaily]

What is the timeframe of the contest?
 
I see that the first post has been updated a little, if a user announces that they would like to participate, what kind of assistance can they expect? a loaner dap? design files? availablility of blank cards -- essentially perfboard that can be plugged directly into a hifiman dap -- would be interesting. I am not sure if this changes the intended scope of the contest.

 

[sbradley02]

  What is the timeframe of the contest?
 
I see that the first post has been updated a little, if a user announces that they would like to participate, what kind of assistance can they expect? a loaner dap? design files? availablility of blank cards -- essentially perfboard that can be plugged directly into a hifiman dap -- would be interesting. I am not sure if this changes the intended scope of the contest.

Per the update they now provide technical support, but what that entails is not clear.
If they don't provide a perfboard (which I doubt they do) it would be a real chore to make it as you would have to etch your own boards.

 

[Makiah S]

 
Per the update they now provide technical support, but what that entails is not clear.
If they don't provide a perfboard (which I doubt they do) it would be a real chore to make it as you would have to etch your own boards.

I don't see this contest going much further, this thread has died. Head Fi pulled it off the front page... here's to hoping in the next week Hifiman has another update that doesn't leave us with more questions